We’re going to have a lot of fun with this. We’re going to get into William Tompkins and some of the amazing research that Michael Salla has done in validating even further some of the claims that might seem pretty outrageous that we’ve been discussing on this show.
So, Corey, welcome back.
Corey Goode: Thank you.
David: Dr. Salla, welcome to the show.
Dr. Michael Salla: Thank you, David.
David: Your site is called “Exopolitics”, so it sounds kind of self-explanatory, but I’d like you to just start by defining what you consider exopolitics to be.
Michael: Oh, sure. Well, I was teaching international politics at American University in Washington, D.C. when I first came across this information about extraterrestrial life and repressed technologies.
And the more I looked into this and did my due diligence, I found out that this was very real.
And so I looked at, well, what is the appropriate term to describe this? And being in international politics, the obvious one was something to do with politics, and, you know, because we have exobiology, exoplanetology, so the logical thing was exopolitics.
So I began to do research on it since that time.
David: When we see people talking about Voyager 2 . . .
. . . and the little plaque that is etched in on that with the image of the two humans . . .
. . . and then here we are, we’re located here, . . .
. . . has your research concluded that that might be unnecessary or redundant? Are we really alone, or have we already been contacted?
Michael: Well, definitely, when you look at all of the whistleblower testimonies that have come forward over the years and all the witnesses, people who have had experiences, it’s not a question of, well, one day, will we discover extraterrestrial life or will they discover us?
We’ve been discovered a long time ago and that they’re actually visiting and interacting with us, and it’s all about just learning about who’s interacting with who, what government agencies, what military departments are involved in this and the cover-up, and the extent of the cooperation.
That’s the thing that most interested me, because I was always wanting to know – well, what is it that’s driving international politics? And so the more we know about the agreements that exist, the more we know about what really is behind international politics.
David: And when we find out that all these decisions are being made without any voting, without any public approval, how have you positioned yourself in this dialogue with exopolitics?
Michael: Well, as a political scientist, I mean, what we really try to do is, you not so much kind of make value judgments about what policies are appropriate or not, but we just try to bring transparency into the whole issue.
Because the more things become transparent, the better decisions you can make about what should be done or what shouldn’t be done. And then accountability. I mean, that’s the key thing.
For political scientists, you’re always looking at – well, how can we make people accountable? How can we make politicians, policy makers accountable for their actions?
And to make it possible for them to become accountable, you need to have transparency. So when we look at this whole extraterrestrial phenomenon, there’s very little transparency.
So that means that people are doing things, making decisions that affect all of us without any knowledge on the side of the public or politicians, representatives that are supposed to be there kind of regulating this in some way, and zero accountability.
So to me, that’s really the goal – to kind of bring transparency, to bring light to all of this phenomenon.
Corey: The lack of transparency, yes, being the problem, that’s where the whistleblowers come in. Correct? And you’ve had access to William Tompkins for some time.
Michael: Right. Well, Bill Tompkins was very interesting because, when I first heard of him at the end of 2015, early 2016, I listened to some audio interviews about him, and he had incredible testimony.
And thankfully, I knew the key person that was involved in his book that actually came out in public in December of 2015 that is, “Selected by Extraterrestrials”.
And Dr. Robert Wood was a colleague, and so I found him, and I said, “Well, how come you’re working with this man, Bill Tompkins, who has this incredible story?”
And Bob told me all about Bill Tompkins’s history.
Corey: Yeah. Bob is known as a nuts and bolts guy.
Michael: And I’ve worked with Bob in the past in terms of validating certain documents, especially concerning the Kennedy assassination.
So to my mind, Bob is really one of the leading experts when it comes to document verification, especially when it comes to these secret projects.
So here he is saying that Bill Tompkins is the real deal, that he did work in this really highly secretive program that was run by the Navy, and then he worked in Douglas Aircraft Company for over a decade, and that his information was legit. So I then followed up.
I went down to actually interview Bill Tompkins in January of 2016 and did about 10 hours of video interviewing and really tried to get to the bottom of his story.
And then I went about the process of checking it out. Well, how valid is it, and do the people he named in his story really exist? Because what Bob would have done was he was able to validate the part of Bill Tompkins’s story in terms of him working at Douglas Aircraft Company for 12 years, from 1950 to 1963.
But what about his time at the Naval Air Station in San Diego? Did that check you? Do the people he named – are they real people?
And the one that was the most problematic was the admiral that was supposedly running this program, which, in the book itself, he actually misspelled the name of the admiral. So we had no way of checking out, well, did this guy really exist?
David: So Michael, when we’re hearing videos with Tompkins, he says “Rick Obatta”. And it sounds like the guy’s name is Rick. So what was the secret that cracked this case, because I thought it was Rick, too?
Michael: Well, in the book, he refers to him as “Rick Obatta”.
Michael: And so we couldn’t find any admiral called “Rick Obatta”, and so there was a breakthrough then eventually.
What happened was that it turned out that his name was “Rico Botta, B-O-T-T-A.
Michael: So once we found his real name, then we were able to kind of track down some biography on him and found out that, yes, this guy really did work for the Navy, that he was an admiral, and that he was in charge of the Naval Air Station in San Diego.
But what was really . . . I found fascinating was that, as we were trying to confirm whether or not this admiral existed and we found the name Rico Botta, but it was like, well, what do we know of him? There was nothing on the Internet about him.
So then just at that same time, in March of 2016, magically, on this Navy Aviator’s website called “The Golden Eagles”, there was a one-page biography of Admiral Rico Botta. It just appeared like that – out of nowhere.
It was almost like we were being helped . . .
Michael: . . . by people inside of the Navy that wanted to give us some assistance.
Corey: Exactly. Right.
Michael: Because prior to March of 2016, there was absolutely nothing on the Internet about Rico Botta.
Corey: That’s very possible since Tompkins is a sanctioned disclosure.
Michael: Well, that’s right, that Tompkins is being helped. And to me, that was a really powerful confirmation that there are people in the Navy that want his story to come out.
Because once that one-page biography came out, then we were able to do due diligence in finding out more about Rico Botta, about his history, what Navy departments he was involved in after the Naval Air Station in San Diego.
So that was a big breakthrough because really confirming Rico Botta was the key in that part of Tompkins’s story where he worked at the Naval Air Station in San Diego.
David: Well, Michael, I’d like to back up a little bit because, as a prominent UFO researcher, you are really one of the only people in the field who has broken ranks and stepped up and actually believed Corey’s story to be credible.
Now, what was it for you that made you feel that Corey was credible?
Michael: Right. Well, one of the things that really kind of helped me was to see how his testimony was so consistent and how his body language was so consistent.
And when I first began to kind of communicate with Corey, back in – what was it – 2016, early 2016 – no, 2015.
Corey: That’s right. ’15.
Michael: Yeah. Early 2015. We did some email interviews. I think we did about a dozen or so like that.
Corey: That’s right.
Michael: And so Corey was responding to questions, and so I would read his responses to those questions and put those out for the public so people could read what Corey was saying.
And so that was really very helpful because then we could see how his questions in these videos matched the questions that he had written down.
Because when you respond in writing, you know, you’re accessing a certain part of the brain.
Michael: Your left brain. And when you’re responding verbally in an interview, then you’re using the right side of the brain. But the things matched. The testimony was the same.
And then there were a lot of things circumstantially that matched, and the one that really kind of was very important for me was when Corey was talking about his trip to Mars in mid-2015 where he said that he went there with Gonzales to investigate slave labor abuses on Mars and described going to a colony where there was this kind of brutal manager of this facility, and he really ran it like a dictatorship.
Well, at the very same time that Corey came out with this information, the British Interplanetary Society organized this symposium in London where they had 30 top aerospace engineers and think tank people as well as some government representatives there discussing the very problem of how to remove a Mars’ corporate dictator, that Mars would have a base in the future where there would be a dictator.
And it’s like how do you remove this person?
Corey: Yeah, it was within days of the information coming out on “Cosmic Disclosure”.
Michael: Exactly. Exactly. And then there was a lot of other kind of congruities in terms of President Obama signing a bill that would actually make space mining immune from any kind of regulatory oversight, which meant that any abuses that were happening in space in terms of corporations abusing slave labor that were doing space mining, that all of that was free from any kind of government regulatory frameworks up until 2022.
So this all began in that same time that Corey was coming out with this information.
So there were a number of other things like that.
David: One of the other noteworthy things I think about here is that you wrote the first book to actually discuss Corey Goode.
Michael: The book title is “Insiders Reveal Secret Space Programs & Extraterrestrial Alliances”. And what I did in there was just used a lot of Corey’s testimony that he had shared through these email interviews.
And so I used a lot of that material and just kind of did due diligence on it in the book in terms of – well, how does this match with historic documents? I mean, one of the key things that Corey said was that Nazi Germany had developed a secret space program and that this was operating out of Nazi Germany and out of Antarctica.
And so I looked into, well, what evidence is there that the Nazis actually did develop a space program? And so there were historic documents that kind of supported that.
One was a set of documents out of fascist Italy from 1933 that showed that Benito Mussolini set up a top secret think tank to study a retrieved flying saucer – that the Italians in 1933 had discovered a flying saucer and that they had set up a top secret group to study it under Guglielmo Marconi. He was the head of it.
And so that showed that Italy, as early as 1933, was studying this phenomenon. And then soon after Italy entered into the agreement with Germany, and they shared all of that technology, all of their findings.
So that kind of supported what Corey was saying.
Corey: And then you fast forward to William Tompkins’s book coming out that is saying very much the same thing, and Tompkins had been writing it throughout the whole time we were doing this show.
Michael: Exactly. Actually, what happened was that Bob Wood got a copy of my book and shared it with Bill Tompkins . . .
Corey: That’s right.
Michael: . . . and said, “This is very similar to what you’re saying” because my book came out in September of 2015, and Bill Tompkin’s book came out in December of 2015.
Michael: And so the book where I’m basically examining your testimony and the history of this Secret Space Program in terms of the role of Nazi Germany with two separate programs – one in Germany and one in Antarctica – that this was something that was in the book.
And Bill Tompkins reads it, and he’s saying, “Oh, my God! How did this information come out? I thought I was the only one that knew about this, and I was going to break it.”
Michael: But he was shocked that someone actually was sharing that before. So that was, to me, a very important corroboration from what you had said.
Corey: And I know you’ve done a lot of research into Tompkins since then. And through all the research that you’ve done, how many correlations have you seen? Has it been consistent?
Michael: Oh, a lot of correlations. I mean, just from very beginning in terms of how it all began, and then the role of the Navy, the US Navy, in putting together their own program to study what the Germans were doing, and then to begin the process of kind of reverse engineering and designing their own ships.
And so that was very important corroboration that Tompkins had to share.
David: So, Corey, when he mentioned fascist Italy finding a UFO, I’ve never heard you on this show, or with any conversation, talk about what was the role of fascist Italy in this whole German Secret Space Program.
Do you have any personal knowledge of that?
Corey: Yes. Yes. A lot of the underground or mountainous types of bases that they had, they had in Italy.
David: Oh, really?
Corey: They were allowed areas in Italy where they could develop technology, and parts of it was developed in Italy.
Michael: And what I found very interesting that correlated between what Corey had to say and what Bill Tompkins had to say was that Marconi took a lot of that information to South America to start up a program down there – a kind of more private program – and Bill Tompkins said the same thing, that Marconi did start up something down in South America and that the Italians actually had a very big space program.
And so that is also one of the things that I found correlating between Bill and Corey.
David: So Michael, did you get into the research of Die Glocke, the German Bell craft and the anti-gravity research that they were doing? Did you cover that in the book?
Michael: I did. That was kind of like the effort by the Nazis to weaponize these kind of technologies during the war.
Michael: So that was part of that kind of program that was run by the Nazi SS and under Kammler, and that’s where you have witnesses who have talked about the Nazi Bell and how that was something that they unsuccessfully attempted to weaponize, but that in Antarctica, you had a lot of the top Nazi scientists going.
And that’s where they really developed their most ambitious and, ultimately, the most effective space program.
Corey: Right. And the non-kinetic weapons to go along with them.
Corey: The energy-based weapons.
David: So did you ever get into Project Highjump, because that’s one of the most remarkable things that Corey’s testimony has shared with us is this idea of a planned invasion of Antarctica after World War II to try to defeat whatever Nazi base was down there?
Did that check out when you did the research?
Michael: Yeah, exactly. That was a very important part of Corey’s testimony, and it’s something I’ve been interested in for a few years. There’s been a lot of rumors about Operation Highjump, and there’s a lot of information out there about Operation Highjump in terms of exactly what it was that Admiral Byrd’s taskforce encountered down there.
But what I found very helpful from Bill Tompkins’s testimony was that he said that there was some context to Operation Highjump, that it wasn’t just this battle where the Navy kind of tried to take out the Nazi base in ’46, ’47, that as a prelude that Admiral Byrd went down to Antarctica in ’45, ’46 to negotiate with the Nazis down there.
So there was an attempt to first negotiate with the Nazis, and that that negotiation was not successful, and that the British had sent their special operations teams down there in that summer of ’45, ’46, which is immediately after the Second World War, after Japan’s surrender in August.
So that meant that after Japan’s surrender in August, four months later, you have the British and the Americans both sending groups down there to Antarctica to find the Germans, to find any bases, and to negotiate, because they had negotiated with the Nazi SS at the end of the war, so they thought they could do the same with the Nazis in Antarctica, but that failed.
And so according to Bill Tompkins, when Admiral Byrd went back to Washington D.C. and said, “Well, the negotiations have failed,” that’s when the Navy decided that, at the next opportunity, which would be the southern hemisphere’s summer of 1946, ’47, they would launch Taskforce 68, which was Operation Highjump.
And, of course, that gave the Germans time to finish the development of directed energy weapons so that they could outfit their flying saucers down there so that, when the Navy showed up, now they had these flying saucers that were very effective in fighting against the Navy’s best fighter planes and took out their destroyers and other ships as well.
Corey: Did Tompkins, in that testimony, happen to mention high-level meetings between the US and the Nazi breakaway faction in Argentina, or did he mention Antarctica?
Michael: He said, in ’45, ’46, that Admiral Byrd went down to Antarctica for conducting those specific negotiations.
Corey: Because I did read about high-level meetings that occurred in Argentina.
David: During the same time frame?
Michael: Right. Okay. Well, that would be very consistent, I think, because there were many kind of stories about Hitler and Kammler and Bormann all going down to South America, setting up what would be the kind of political power, or the political center, of the Fourth Reich.
Corey: And they’re also the gatekeepers to what’s going on in Antarctica.
Michael: Right. I think that’s . . . Yes, so there would’ve been negotiations there or meetings there, but Byrd apparently just went down to Antarctica straight to conduct these negotiations, according to Bill Tompkins.
David: Now, you may remember – I’m sure you do – the insider that Rich Dolan interviewed who said that there was a plan at one point to invade Area 51 from the President of the United States.
So I think it might be good for you to share what you know about that with us right now as a context to Highjump.
Corey: I think a president actually made a threat to invade with the army – with the First Army Division or something.
Michael: Yes, that’s right. That was a whistleblower that Linda Moulton Howe first interviewed about 12 years ago. He used the pseudonym Cooper, and he said that he was part of a CIA team that was commanded by President Eisenhower to go to Area 51, to the S4 facility, and to find out what was going on down there, because Eisenhower felt that he was out of the loop – that the agreements that had been reached with the Nazis, with extraterrestrials, Eisenhower assumed that as the President, as the Commander-in-Chief, that there would be a chain of command, because that’s what he was used to.
Michael: But what became clear was that the people running things in Area 51, they had a different vision of how these projects would be run and that infuriated Eisenhower because he didn’t have a problem with secrecy – keeping things secret – but he had a big problem with going outside of the chain of command.
So when he found out that the people running the projects out of S4 and Area 51, what he decided to do was that he said that he would basically use the First Army that was stationed in Denver, Colorado, to invade Area 51 if they didn’t basically report – give him an adequate report, a full report – on what was happening down there.
So Cooper, this whistleblower, was part of that team that went down to the S4 facility. And he described what he saw at the facility, and he said that he saw nine craft. Out of those nine craft, he said four were from Nazi Germany.
Two of those four were the very first Vril craft that had been developed by Maria Orsic and the Vril Society, . . .
Michael: . . . and the other two were Haunebu that had been developed by the Nazi SS for the weaponization program, and that the other five were extraterrestrial crafts.
So Cooper’s testimony is important because it gives another independent source of evidence that there were these discoveries of Nazi programs involving flying saucers and that the American military had retrieved some of these.
He wanted to kind of clear his chest on this issue.
Michael: He really wanted to have a clear conscience that he had told the truth about some really important historical events that he was associated with, and he just didn’t want to take that information to the grave.
So he’s just one of many whistleblowers who have that conscience that this is information that the public needs to know, and they’re willing to put themselves at great risk in sharing that.
David: So, Corey, we’ve got a situation here where you have Nazis in Antarctica. An invasion is attempted. It fails.
Then you have Eisenhower trying to invade Area 51. He fails. He warns about the military-industrial complex.
How do you . . . How does the Alliance see disclosure taking place? Because when people find out the kind of stuff, the exopolitic stuff, that Salla’s talking about, they’re going to be very upset.
There’s totally non-governmental things going on for 70 years.
Corey: Right. Well, the Alliance perspective is let’s just rip the Band-Aid off, start the healing.
What they’re coming up against – this is the SSP Alliance – the Earth-based Alliance of all these various countries, some of them in the BRICS Alliance, have come together and started negotiating with what we’re calling “the Cabal”.
And the Alliance, they have plenty to lose in these disclosures as well, but what they’ve decided to do is do a very protracted disclosure over decades. And that’s just not good enough.
And what’s really occurring within the Alliance – the SSP Alliance – is that they’re trying to grease the wheels so that releasing information about Antarctica before the Cabal releases their sanitized version.
This is all an attempt to make this sanitized disclosure impossible.
David: Well, Michael, you said you wanted transparency, and some of transparency is going to include people getting really mad and becoming violent.
So how do you see this transparency as a key to solving our exopolitical issues?
Michael: Well, because with the transparency, then you can have accountability. You can have congressional inquiries. You can have inspector generals of various departments.
You can have senior military officers kind of finding out what their subordinates have been doing, because a lot of this has happened outside of the chain of command – that what happened to Eisenhower wasn’t an isolated incident, that it goes on today.
So you actually have, for example, four-star admirals not knowing what a captain might be doing who’s involved in one of these programs. Similarly for the Air Force and the Army.
So that’s the key is with transparency then you have accountability. And I think that’s the process, and that’s really what I hope to be able to achieve in doing this research.
David: How do you feel the fear factor can be addressed? Like have you encountered a lot of fear from your audience as you disclose this and try to reach transparency?
That’s what we’re always warned about, right, is people are going to be so afraid that they can’t handle the truth.
Michael: Well, the fear I’ve run into is more from the whistleblowers, the witnesses, that are fearful about sharing this. What is going to be happening to them?
I remember talking very vividly with Clifford Stone and giving him an interview, doing an interview with him, about 10 years ago. And he was telling me, “Look. After I finish talking to you, they’re going to come in here and beat me up, but I don’t care. I don’t care. I can handle it.”
Because he knew that this was what was going on, that that was the price for revealing the truth.
Michael: As a researcher, or for in the part of the audience, I haven’t felt that much fear in terms of revealing this. It’s really the whistleblowers, the primary witnesses, that are really fearful for their safety and their families.
Corey: Yeah, I’d have to agree.
David: Do you think that this fear card is something that is being pulled as an excuse to maintain secrecy?
David: Or do you think that people will actually be afraid when it comes out?
Corey: They genuinely believe that there will be a complete breakdown of society. They genuinely believe this. They’ve tested it. They’ve brought in scientists and soldiers, and unbeknownst to them, they expose them to an alien or to this information and then read their response.
After . . . You know, they have personality profiles on people that work for them, so they have different personality types.
They think this one will react that way if they have a Christian background, which many in the military did.
So, no, they genuinely believe that if there was a Full Disclosure, they believe that it’s irresponsible to do because it will cause deaths, mayhem, rioting in the streets. And they’re right. It will. That’s part of the process.
But if we keep kicking the can down the road, the reaction’s just going to be worse.
David: If the beings that you’re working with are benevolent, and they want Full Disclosure, what is their rationale for how we will respond as a people to Full Disclosure, and why they’re pushing for it?
Corey: Basically, the most important thing to these higher-density beings is the development of consciousness.
Us not having transparency is holding back this consciousness renaissance that we’re primed for.
So the minute we get this information, yes, it’s going to be a bitter pill. But in the long run, it’s going to have a bigger payoff for us in the development of our joint co-creative consciousness.
David: Well, it’s a very good message, and I hope you’ve enjoyed this. I know I have. This is “Cosmic Disclosure”. I’m David Wilcock here with our insider, Corey Goode, and our special guest, Dr. Michael Salla of the Exopolitics Institute. We thank you for watching.